'Nation'? Wot Nation?

Neither Oceania nor Euroasia Emmanuel Goldstein - 164th post - 19 Sep 2004 16:29
Britain is a nation, which stands in danger of losing mastery over its own destiny, and hence its democracy.
Europe appears to be moving in an uncertain direction, politically. America, has taken many wrong turnings.

That is not to say that Britain should be hostile to either America or Europe, but I do feel that Britain should retain its self mastery and independence.
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re: Neither Oceania nor Euroasia Little Richardjohn - 96th post - 19 Sep 2004 17:32
Where you bin?
Mastery of its own destiny? I can't think of a time since 1914, at the latest, when Britain had anything remotely like 'sovereignty'. Ever since then we've been pushed from pillar to post by a succession of super power hostilities and economic forces, both totally beyond our control.
We are not 'a nation'. The 19th century concept of the nation state is dead, muerte, kaput. It was a product of the Steam Age, and we are now living in an age of electronic pulses.
The democratic model which evolved to sanction the sport of hunting spear-throwers with gunships and to keep the masses from realising that they were being robbed blind doesn't apply any more. People are not conned by the facade of statehood, which is why no-one votes any more, and why the political right is the cancerous tumour we see today.
The fact is, we are a medium sized market on the fringes of two enormous geographical currency blocks. With China shaping up to be the major trading force within the next five years, and Europe having nowhere else to hide, we have to make up our minds pretty damn quick about who we are. Americans or Europeans.
This will involve sacrifice all round for some, but not in terms of a 'sovereignty' which we haven't had for a hundred years. The Left has to realise, too, that the same technology which gave us our concept of the Industrial Nation State also enabled what we commonly understand as socialism. Both are now due for a major overhaul if either is to achieve any of its core objectives.